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AZProgressive

(29,606 posts)
Sat Jun 21, 2025, 05:50 PM Saturday

American Democracy Might Not Survive a War With Iran

The current debate over bombing Iran is surreal. To begin with, bombardment is unlikely to lead to a satisfactory outcome. If history has shown one thing, it is that achieving a lasting resolution by bombing alone is almost impossible. There was a reason the United States sent ground forces into Iraq in 2003, and it was not to plant democracy. It was that American officials believed they could not solve the problem of Saddam Hussein’s weapons programs simply by bombing. They had tried that. The Clinton administration bombed Iraq for four days in 1998. At the end, they had no idea what they had destroyed and what they hadn’t. They certainly knew they had not put a permanent end to the program. In 2003, if George W. Bush thought he could have permanently ended Saddam’s weapons programs by bombing alone, he would have taken that option.

Iran today poses the same dilemma. America’s weapons may be better than they were in 2003, its intelligence capabilities greater, and Iran may be weaker than it was even a year ago, but the problem remains. Bombing alone will not achieve a verifiable and lasting end to Iran’s nuclear program. It can buy time, and Israel’s strikes have done that. American strikes could extend that period, but a determined Iranian regime will likely try again. A permanent solution would require a far more intrusive international verification regime, which in turn would require a ground presence for protection.

However, that is not the main reason I oppose bombing Iran. Nor is it the reason I find the discussion of all of this so bizarre. You would never know, as The New York Times churns out its usual policy-option thumb-suckers, that the United States is well down the road to dictatorship at home.

That is the context in which a war with Iran will occur. Donald Trump has assumed dictatorial control over the nation’s law enforcement. The Justice Department, the police, ICE agents, and the National Guard apparently answer to him, not to the people or the Constitution. He has neutered Congress by effectively taking control of the power of the purse. And, most relevant in Iran’s case, he is actively and openly turning the U.S. military into his personal army, for use as he sees fit, including as a tool of domestic oppression. Whatever action he does or doesn’t take in Iran will likely be in furtherance of these goals. When he celebrates the bombing of Iran, he will be celebrating himself and his rule. The president ordered a military parade to honor his birthday. Imagine what he will do when he proclaims military success in Iran. The president is working to instill in our nation’s soldiers a devotion to him and him alone. Imagine how that relationship will blossom if he orders what he will portray as a successful military mission.

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2025/06/democracy-iran-israel-war-trump/683269/

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American Democracy Might Not Survive a War With Iran (Original Post) AZProgressive Saturday OP
I remember Bush landing on the carrier doc03 Saturday #1
I would be surprised if Trump attacks Iran Bluestocking Saturday #2
Trump was humiliated by that parade Skittles Saturday #3
I'm surprised Bluestocking Yesterday #4

doc03

(37,992 posts)
1. I remember Bush landing on the carrier
Sat Jun 21, 2025, 06:09 PM
Saturday

with a banner claiming Mission Acomplished, afterwords we were mired in Iraq for 20 years.

Bluestocking

(129 posts)
2. I would be surprised if Trump attacks Iran
Sat Jun 21, 2025, 06:29 PM
Saturday

since his boss, Putin, has already told him he can’t.

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